Online music database?

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Hi,

I would like to catalog my CD collection on the
Web. I thought
I would do this by pointing to Amazon, for example, but the first
CD I looked at isn't in their database. Are there better music
database (the "imdb" of music) that I might point to?

Anyone have any good ideas for this type of project?

- Ian

--
Ian Jacobs ([email protected])   http://www.w3.org/People/Jacobs
Tel:                         +1 831 457-2842
Cell:                        +1 917 450-8783

Re: Online music database?

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On Mon, Nov 13, 2000, Ian Jacobs wrote:
> I would like to catalog my CD collection on the
> Web. I thought
> I would do this by pointing to Amazon, for example, but the first
> CD I looked at isn't in their database. Are there better music
> database (the "imdb" of music) that I might point to?
>
> Anyone have any good ideas for this type of project?

The CD database:

 http://www.cddb.org/

--
Hugo Haas <[email protected]> - http://larve.net/people/hugo/
Hey, did you hear that? Sounds like a giraffe is dying over there.

Re: Online music database?

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At 23:05 11/13/2000 -0500, Ian Jacobs wrote:
>I would like to catalog my CD collection on the
>Web.

Pick up a free CueCat and use that to scan all the CDs.
       http://air-soldier.com/~cuecat/

__
Regards,          http://www.mit.edu/~reagle/
Joseph Reagle     E0 D5 B2 05 B6 12 DA 65  BE 4D E3 C1 6A 66 25 4E
MIT LCS Research Engineer at the World Wide Web Consortium.

* This email is from an independent academic account and is
not necessarily representative of my affiliations.

Cue Cat woes [Was: Re: Online music database?]

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"Joseph M. Reagle Jr." wrote:
>
> At 23:05 11/13/2000 -0500, Ian Jacobs wrote:
> >I would like to catalog my CD collection on the
> >Web.
>
> Pick up a free CueCat and use that to scan all the CDs.
>         http://air-soldier.com/~cuecat/

So, I finally did as Mr. Reagle suggested and got myself
a Cue Cat at the local Radio Shack. When I picked it up,
the guy at the counter looked at me knowingly and said
"You'll find a lot more on this on the Web." I think he
meant "go get your declawed."

I have had no luck since then. I visited the home of the
Cue Cat project [1] to get a driver, but I am not having
any luck making it work. There's a stand-alone program
called "read_cuecat" that I think is supposed to listen
to the cue cat and spit out the bar code info on stdout.
[I'm not sure, since there's no documentation, but the code
suggests this.]

You can also patch the kernel and get built-in support
for this device using cuecat, and I tried that too with
no luck (using cuecat-0.2.1, not the latest version, since
the latest version doesn't work for my kernel version
2.2.16-22).

I am using a Truform external keyboard with my laptop.
The keyboard has a pointing stick in the middle of it.
So I am using the serial port with the mouse [because the
physical layout of the back of my computer prevents me from
using the PS/2 ports for both keyboard and mouse - they are
too close together for the adapters that I have) and a PS/2
port for the keyboard (but not the PS/2 port with the keyboard
icon next to it, the one with the mouse icon next to it). I
mention this because the README that comes with cuecat-0.2.1
says:

"read_cuecat can read data from your CueCat off of the
 regular PS/2 keyboard port or off a serial port.
 In the latter case, you need to build a CueCat RS232 pod
 (see instructions in the "cuecat_RS232_pod" to build it)."

So the fact that you have to build another piece of hardware
yourself is fairly dissuasive, so I'm not apt to use a serial
port. The README continues:

"NOTE : read_cuecat does NOT work under X if you have a
        connected on your PS/2 port. Bad things may happen
        if you run read_cuecat as root under X.
        Instead, you should run read_cuecat in a plain text
        console."

Also very dissuasive if you can't use the driver under X Windows.
However, I shut down X Windows and had no luck anyway.

Further down the README:

 "A program that uses a PS/2 mouse, like GPM or X11,
  needs to run *prior* to trying to use the PS/2 portion
  of the CueCat driver, otherwise the PS/2 mouse will die
  and the console may lock. I have added the PS/2 feature
  as a nicety for the many people who asked it for the
  sake of pushing the enveloppe. I doubt very much that
  it can be of any real use ever with a mouse attached,
  and/or with X."

So it sounds like:

a) To use the serial port feature of this driver,
   you have to build your own hardware (see the author's
   diagrams for doing so).
b) You shouldn't use the PS/2 feature anyway, and especially
   not under X.

Am I missing something?

To verify that the cue cat was "working" at all, I ran xev and
was able to see that in fact, there were some events being
thrown when I ran the cat over a bar code (and not being thrown,
for example, when I ran it over a paragraph of text). So, the
device seems to work, but read_cuecat doesn't send anything
to stdout. And after using the cue cat, I lose the keyboard
(but not every time).

There seems to be other software that one can use, such as
jcat [2] (in Java). I tried this, too, without success and X
Windows crashed. Looking at the documentation [3], it looks
like the driver is part of the package:

 "To use JCat simply type:
     java -jar jcat.jar
 or use the included jcat.bat file.

 Once the program is running, use the CueCat to scan
 a barcode. The bar code should appear in the topmost
 text field."

NOTE: I was a little hasty and tried to "declaw" my cue cat
before testing it out of the package. I stopped, I believe,
before severing the lead in question, so I don't think I broke
the cue cat or even modified it yet. Still, there is a shadow
of a doubt.

- Ian

[1] http://oss.lineo.com/cuecat/
[2] http://www.timpatton.com/jcat/
[3] http://www.timpatton.com/jcat/doc/
--
Ian Jacobs ([email protected])   http://www.w3.org/People/Jacobs
Tel:                         +1 831 457-2842
Cell:                        +1 917 450-8783

Re: Cue Cat woes [Was: Re: Online music database?]

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Parents:

Ian Jacobs wrote:
>
> I am using a Truform external keyboard with my laptop.
> The keyboard has a pointing stick in the middle of it.
> So I am using the serial port with the mouse [because the
> physical layout of the back of my computer prevents me from
> using the PS/2 ports for both keyboard and mouse - they are
> too close together for the adapters that I have) and a PS/2
> port for the keyboard (but not the PS/2 port with the keyboard
> icon next to it, the one with the mouse icon next to it).

I rebooted with the keyboard plugged into the keyboard PS/2
port instead of the mouse PS/2 port. The keyboard works fine
that way. Am I correct in assuming that the ports are scanned
during boot and it doesn't matter which port the keyboard
is attached to?

I tried read_cuecat with the keyboard plugged into the keyboard
PS/2 port and it still didn't work. So that's enough for today.

- Ian

--
Ian Jacobs ([email protected])   http://www.w3.org/People/Jacobs
Tel:                         +1 831 457-2842
Cell:                        +1 917 450-8783

Re: Online music database?

Replies:

Parents:

On Mon, Nov 13, 2000, Ian Jacobs wrote:
> I would like to catalog my CD collection on the
> Web. I thought
> I would do this by pointing to Amazon, for example, but the first
> CD I looked at isn't in their database. Are there better music
> database (the "imdb" of music) that I might point to?
>
> Anyone have any good ideas for this type of project?

I thought about that, and I think that I have been somehow contaminated
by Gerald, because I now want to log everything.

So in addition to creating a catalog of CD's, I would like to keep track
of all the CD's I listen to. The concept is actually pretty simple: if
you have the list of your CD's, you just indicate (by clicking on a
button in a GUI or entering a reference) the one you were listening to,
associated with a date.

The reason for that is that I noticed that there are cycles in the music
I listen to, and that would be interesting to analyze them. For example,
since I saw Steve Vai live last year[1,2], I keep listening to his music
again and again.

I realize that if I had all my CD's converted in MP3's, that tracking
would be easier and could be automated, but I like putting my CD's in
the CD tray, plus I am religious about music and I like to listen to
entire albums as a whole. Of course, you can do that with MP3's too, but
I would be tempted to listen to my favorite songs. :-)

To close on music, Steve Vai, and considering albums as whole thing,
Steve Vai just released a very interesting compilation of songs, called
The 7th Song[3]. He took the 7th track of each of his records, which has
always been a balad. I am not sure I want to buy it because I basically
have all the songs already except the 3 bonus tracks and one of them
(Boston Rain Melody) was distributed in MP3 on his site[4] at some
point, but it is definitely interesting.

 1. http://larve.net/people/hugo/1999/09/08-vai
 2. http://larve.net/people/hugo/1999/11/19-vai
 3. http://www.vai.com/News/images/7thsong_larger.jpg
 4. http://www.vai.com/

--
Hugo Haas <[email protected]> - http://larve.net/people/hugo/
Ok children, today we're going to learn about a Japanese poem called
haiku. A haiku is just like an American poem, except that it doesn't
rhyme and it's totally stupid. -- Mr Garrisson

Re: Online music database?

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On Sat, Nov 18, 2000, Hugo Haas wrote:
> So in addition to creating a catalog of CD's, I would like to keep track
> of all the CD's I listen to. The concept is actually pretty simple: if
> you have the list of your CD's, you just indicate (by clicking on a
> button in a GUI or entering a reference) the one you were listening to,
> associated with a date.

I wanted to try this out, so I quickly hacked something (almost no
documentation, flat files, overly simple interface) which would do the
job[1].

I will see if I find this useful. Everything is in a standard format
(e.g. CDDB native format for the disc information) so it will be easy to
reuse any part of it for something else.

 1. http://larve.net/people/hugo/2000/11/cdlog

--
Hugo Haas <[email protected]> - http://larve.net/people/hugo/
I met a devil named Buena Buena.

Re: Online music database?

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Parents:

On Sat, Nov 18, 2000 at 09:17:24PM -0500, Hugo Haas wrote:
> On Mon, Nov 13, 2000, Ian Jacobs wrote:
> > I would like to catalog my CD collection on the Web. I thought
> > I would do this by pointing to Amazon, for example, but the first
> > CD I looked at isn't in their database. Are there better music
> > database (the "imdb" of music) that I might point to?
> >
> > Anyone have any good ideas for this type of project?

I ripped almost all my CDs (150 out of of 200 or so) to MP3s a
while ago, so creating a list of them is now a Unix one-liner.
I haven't put the list online yet for privacy reasons (though I
don't really know why.)

> I thought about that, and I think that I have been somehow contaminated
> by Gerald, because I now want to log everything.

:)

> So in addition to creating a catalog of CD's, I would like to keep track
> of all the CD's I listen to. The concept is actually pretty simple: if
> you have the list of your CD's, you just indicate (by clicking on a
> button in a GUI or entering a reference) the one you were listening to,
> associated with a date.
>
> The reason for that is that I noticed that there are cycles in the music
> I listen to, and that would be interesting to analyze them. For example,
> since I saw Steve Vai live last year[1,2], I keep listening to his music
> again and again.

Yeah... I would love to find out what my favorite music was last
year or the year before, but I can't because I didn't keep track
of that anywhere.

Fortunately I fixed that a month ago, using xmms' "Song Change"
plugin; I configured it to execute this whenever a song changes:

   echo `date +"%Y-%m-%d %T"` "%f %r %F %lms %s" >> misc/mm/whatson

(~/misc/mm is a symlink to ~/misc/2000/11, updated monthly)

The 25 most recent tracks I have listened to:

   http://impressive.net/people/gerald/2000/10/whatson

(currently just a dump of recent log entries, but eventually I'll
fix it up, link each artist/album to amazon.com or whatever.)

Unfortunately it doesn't log individual tracks from shoutcast/
icecast streams; I've been listening to this stream a lot in the
last week or so:

   http://www.monkeyradio.net/

but it only shows up as a single entry in my log. (I can probably
fix that by actively querying xmms once in a while.)

> I realize that if I had all my CD's converted in MP3's, that tracking
> would be easier and could be automated, but I like putting my CD's in
> the CD tray, plus I am religious about music and I like to listen to
> entire albums as a whole. Of course, you can do that with MP3's too, but
> I would be tempted to listen to my favorite songs. :-)

Come on, CDs are obsolete! The first thing I do when I get a new
CD is rip it, then put it back in the case and never touch it again.
I still haven't unpacked my box of CDs since I moved last summer.
(one of the heaviest boxes, btw; what a waste of atoms)

Having random access to thousands of tracks at once is so cool.
If I'm lazy, I can put a certain playlist or a bunch of CDs on
shuffle, but a lot of the time I listen to entire albums, and I
can use my shell's tab-completion to type the names in for me
instead of having to take my hands off the keyboard to grab a CD :)

I think I listen to entire albums more than I shuffle; I'll be
able to tell you for sure once I have more log data to analyze ;)

I don't know what I'll do about this stuff when I buy a car: either
find a good in-car MP3 player or just listen to the radio. (I like
to check what all the kids are listening to once in a while anyway.)

> To close on music, Steve Vai, and considering albums as whole thing,
> Steve Vai just released a very interesting compilation of songs, called
> The 7th Song[3]. He took the 7th track of each of his records, which has
> always been a balad. I am not sure I want to buy it because I basically
> have all the songs already except the 3 bonus tracks and one of them
> (Boston Rain Melody) was distributed in MP3 on his site[4] at some
> point, but it is definitely interesting.

See, with my setup I could just do "xmms /home/mp3s/mine/steve_vai/*/07*"

Or I could be creative and do "06*" instead, and voila: a new album,
The 6th Song.

>   1. http://larve.net/people/hugo/1999/09/08-vai
>   2. http://larve.net/people/hugo/1999/11/19-vai
>   3. http://www.vai.com/News/images/7thsong_larger.jpg
>   4. http://www.vai.com/

--
Gerald Oskoboiny <[email protected]>
http://impressive.net/people/gerald/

HURL: fogo mailing list archives, maintained by Gerald Oskoboiny